M32 integration with Aviom 360 system

  1. #1 by David Donnel Manning on 06-11-2018
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    M32 integration with Aviom 360 system

    I am installing a Midas M32 in a church that has an existing Aviom system that they would like to keep. They have 2 AN16i feeding into multiple 360 units. Per the Aviom site their solution for the x32 is to use 2 S16's outputs to feed the second AN16i and use the XLR outs of console for first AN16i. This would give them 32 channels to pick from. My question is how to accomplish this via the routing menu of X32 along with keeping my L-R output to my main speaker system. Plus I need to feed 8 in-ear wireless systems (bus 1-8), sub aux (bus 9), a pulpit wedge (bus 10). Bus 11 with be multi-purpose type gang mix to feed aviom channel input. Not sure if I can use 2 DL32's to get my 32 outs and use the console for my other needs for ears and such. Please help!
  2. #2 by Paul Vannatto on 06-11-2018
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    Hi David,

    Welcome to the forum. I've been pondering this since you first posted it. The only way I can see using 2 DL32 is by using both AES50 ports on the M32. The reason is that none of the stageboxes automatically shift the outputs over in banks of 8 or 16, like they do for the inputs (see S16 Cascading. The S16, DL16, SD8 and SD16 can be switched to shift by one (Out+8) or two (Out+16) banks only, thus providing only 24 outputs total per AES50.

    The snag will be if you also need to integrate other X32 or M32 consoles, because you can't daisy chain through the stageboxes (due to the internal banks switching of the inputs).

    The routing in the M32 should not be an issue, since you will probably be sending direct inputs to the Aviom 360. Therefore they can be assigned the AES50 inputs to the outputs (in banks of 8). You did mention that bus 11 would be a gang mix of inputs. If you need to combine this with other direct inputs, it can be done on the Routing Ultranet screen in order to build a bank of 8, then assign that bank to one of the AES50 outputs (banks of 8).

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  3. #3 by Craig Fowler on 06-11-2018
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    A single DL32+a pair of ADA8200s will provide your 32 analogue outs for the 2x AN16i, and only require the use of 1 AES50 socket.

    As long as you're feeding DOs for Avioms from preamps, you'll have enough stagable blocks in the M32's routing table to do your bus1-10 and FOH, but they'd have to come out of the console's XLR\TRS sockets, not the stagebox. If you run another AES50 line to the stage and stick another couple of stageboxes on it, you can run bus1-10+FOH from that stagebox instead of from the console.

    Alternatively, an X-MADI card+4x ADA8200s would also work, but then you're limited by cable length unless you get some media converters.

    DL32 (for inputs+IEMs+LR) + an X32Core with X-MADI + 4x ADA8200s for the Aviom system + the M32 for mixing FOH could work too.

    Bottom line is you're wanting a system with at least 42x analogue outs (not accounting for any other audio distribution around the building, delay fills, front fills etc,) ... which is kind of a lot. A lot of this really depends on where the AN16Is + console + IEM racks + wedge\FOH amps are physically located, stage or the mix position. If you can give us some more ideas about where stuff is, we can give more tailored advice.
  4. #4 by Paul Vannatto on 06-11-2018
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    - Craig Fowler wrote View Post
    A single DL32+a pair of ADA8200s will provide your 32 analogue outs for the 2x AN16i, and only require the use of 1 AES50 socket.
    Excellent idea Craig - forgot the DL32 had ADAT outs tied to the 17-32 outputs. I would say that would be the most cost effective as well. Glad to have you around

    The only downside I can think of is the outputs would be at the back (when rackmounted) in contrast to the DL32. But that shouldn't be a big deal.

    __________________________________________________ _______________________
    For additional help please refer to the X32 wiki pages for updated and current documentation about the X32.

    For official technical and warranty support for your product you should contact the support team through their CARE department. You can contact CARE by phone at (+1) 702-800-8290 for the US and Canada and (+44) 1562 732290 in Europe.

    You can also contact CARE via email at CARECREA@music-group.com. They strive to respond to emails within 24-48 hours during normal business hours, but please be patient if it takes longer due to the volume of emails they receive.


    Paul Vannatto
    Volunteer Forum Community Moderator
  5. #5 by Craig Fowler on 06-11-2018
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    2x DL16s + 4x ADA8200s would work too, (32x preamps, 32 analogue outs for Aviom via the ADA8200s,) 16 analogue outs from the DL16s themselves for bus1-10+LR, and all of these would be at the stage end.

    For the most flexibility it would require using both AES50 sockets on the console, which could be a problem later if you wanted to incorporate another X\M32 into the system.

    However, if the OP is happy 16x of the Aviom signals to be fed directly from preamps, then one of the DL16s could be in mode1-3 (to accommodate that pesky bus11,) and the other in mode 4-7, and then only one AES50 socket from the console is required.

    Again though, it depends where the gear is physically located due to cable length constraints.

    Edit: Also, use the M\C bus for your subs, otherwise you'll have bus9 wanting to be fed post-fader, and bus10 wanting to be fed pre-fader, and that won't work, so you'll waste a bus. The M\C bus can also be set to depend on the LR fader too, which is handy (whereas bus9 can't, and the LRMC+mtxs can't be controlled by DCAs, which is annoying.)

    Final edit: DL32 for preamps+analogue outs for bus1-10+LR, sell the 2x AN16Is, replace them with a single D800-Dante, get an X-Dante card in the console. Done, except it could impinge on a multitrack recording, depending on exactly what you want recorded... chances there will be some overlap between signals you want to record and signals you want in the Aviom system. Depending on how much you can sell the AN16Is for, this solution is comparable in price to the 4x ADA8200s, and interconnectivity is via Ethernet rather than lightpipe, so less cable length restrictions, and you don't have to patch 32 cables from the ADA8200s to the AN16Is.

    Last edited by Craig Fowler; 06-11-2018 at 03:40 PM.
  6. #6 by David Donnel Manning on 06-12-2018
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    I have attached a spreadsheet with what i'm pondering. I like the solution of using 1 DS32 with a couple ADA8200's. My main question is how to route all of this. Thanks for all your help!!
    Attached Files Attached Files
  7. #7 by Gary Higgins on 06-12-2018
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    It looks like the AN16Is are 16 ch each? Coming from 2 separate source groups? How do they get combined...or don’t they? Is it a choice of one mix or the other? Sure is a LOT of wire spaghetti there.

    It appears the newer v2 AN16i’s can combine with additional hardware? That is separate from the 360’s? Just curious if that’s how this system is set up. If not, seems like it could be done with other set ups and be a whole lot less money and wiring...

    Last edited by Gary Higgins; 06-13-2018 at 04:05 PM.